Another question...

Fuel & Fluids - What to feed the beast.

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rustbucket
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Another question...

Post by rustbucket » Sun Mar 11th, 2007 5:59

Is it normal for the oil filter housing to hold oil in it (all the way to the top) when the motor is not running, or is it clogged(I think it is).

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Post by Johnny_S » Sun Mar 11th, 2007 8:37

There will always be a little oil in the breather cap....I think that's what you are referring to.....it can and does get clogged. Soak in a solvent of some sort (being careful not to explode it or get on your hands too much). And, depending on how well the engine is actually running.....ie...valves, rings, blowback from some other source....it will oil up again soon enough.

rustbucket
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Post by rustbucket » Sun Mar 11th, 2007 10:27

Not the cap, the oil resevoir with the filter in it, on the drivers side at the back of the motor. It has two oil lines from the block going inot it.

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Post by Johnny_S » Mon Mar 12th, 2007 8:40

Ahah....yes, absolutely. That's the equivalent of the spin on oil filter that is used today on cars. There are two types on these old cars. One is a replaceable cannister that does not have a removeable top. Its a self contained oil filter and has to be completely replaced just like a spin on filter. The other type allows you to remove the top (there's a hex nut on top) and it has a removeable filter inside. You just have to replace that filter on the inside when you change oil...just like a spin on filter.

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Post by Johnny_S » Mon Mar 12th, 2007 8:43

I guess you actual concern was whether or not it should remain full or not. I would expect that since those lines are small it would take some time to drain back but it should drain back some I believe. I'm not actually sure how much however. Those lines aren't very large and they don't filter all of the oil all of the time like modern system. I'll see if I have any tech notes that talk about it.

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Post by rustbucket » Mon Mar 12th, 2007 12:16

When I first looked in it, it was about half full, and it had been sitting for 12 years. If it is anything like the oil I pulled out of the pan, the line is most likely clogged. After getting her to run, the oil now sits at almost full, even after sitting for a few hours.

I am pretty sure I'll have to unclog something in there, but I want to be certain about what I do on this car, it's the oldest one I have worked on and some of it still new to me.

Is the filter something I may find at a local parts house or is it a specialty type order?

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Post by Johnny_S » Mon Mar 12th, 2007 12:58

You can find replacements ... let me find the number and post for you.

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Post by Johnny_S » Mon Mar 12th, 2007 1:30

Here are the replacement types that I believe (emphasis on "believe") are the ones you are looking for.....pull out the other one.....drain it off and measure it to be sure. I think the NAPA 1080 or the Fram C134A
filters will work. But, take your measurements and don't buy a million of them until you verify they are the right ones for you specific application. (there...that's a sufficient disclaimer :-) I do think those are the right numbers however.

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Post by rustbucket » Mon Mar 12th, 2007 10:55

Cool, thank you!

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Post by rustbucket » Fri Mar 16th, 2007 10:48

Still having no drain, I even cleared out the two copper lines that run to and from the filter housing. It seems like it should be flowing, but I don't see any signs of it. The oil pressure guage says I have about 40lbs of oil pressure at idle, so I know there is sufficient oil pressure, it just doesn't seem to be flowing thru the filter.

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Post by Johnny_S » Sat Mar 17th, 2007 6:16

One thing to keep in mind is that these filters don't work exactly like the filters on current technology vehicles. These older cars have a partial flow through system wherein only a little of the oil actually flows through the filter at a time. Compared to a more contempory filter process where virtually 100% of the oil flows through the filter as it cycles. The amount of oil that gets "filtered" is much less both in total volume and effectiveness in these older cars. You may actually be seeing something close to the appropriate volume if there is oil going into the filter at all. I would only declare it "plugged" if you aren't seeing any....before you decide to tear it down just for that reason. If you are seeing 40 lbs at the gauge then you are still getting good pressure from the oil pump. I run 40 or a little more at anything over about 900-1000 rpms.

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Post by Johnny_S » Sat Mar 17th, 2007 7:09

Here's a link to a very good document about engine oiling in our old mopars.....

http://www.imperialclub.com/Repair/Lit/ ... Page01.htm

This one will probably tell you more about engine oiling systems than you care to know but its from the era and about our cars almost entirely.

Johnny S

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Post by adam_knox » Fri Mar 23rd, 2007 7:03

I'll check my filter in the next couple of days to let you know (I just put a new one in). As I recall after I had shut the car off for a about 3 minutes to check that it was working it was about half full when i lifted up the filter.
Are you using a metal canaster filter or a round paper one? Just curious as I normally use a canister one, but the auto store in town gave me a paper mesh one that fits...

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Post by rustbucket » Sat Mar 24th, 2007 11:54

The filter that I pulled out was a paper element type, I have not replaced it yet, I will after I am certain that it's working.

The article at the link had mentioned checking the filter housing for heat from warm oil moving thru it, I have not felt any change in temperature, so I am going to drain it, remove it and clean it (and the lines) out. Hopefully the blockage is not in the oil journals.

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Post by plym49 » Sun Sep 28th, 2008 7:19

It's normal for the cannisters to retain oil. If you are not sure just crank the engine over with coil disconnected and the top of the cannister off. The starter solenoid is right there so you can jump the solenoid right there.

It would be very unlikely for these lines to clog. 40 psi will squirt them right thru. If the supply is blocked, you can tell with the above test. If the return is blocked, you'd probably see seepage at where the top of the cannister sits. You can remove and blow thru these lines.

But, again, bypass-type filters will retain oil. It's a good thing as they don't have to pump up again to resume filtering. Maybe the viscosity of the oil, the fact that the cannister would be draining against a vacuum with the motor off, or whatever prevent it from happening.

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