I Can't Get No, Satisfaction - or - My 49 P-18 Won't Start

What to do with all those wires.

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perrymedik
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Re: I Can't Get No, Satisfaction - or - My 49 P-18 Won't Sta

Post by perrymedik » Mon Feb 21st, 2011 3:19

So I would like to play a game called "What should I see. . ."

I pulled off the Carb, and when I look past the butterfly to the chamber below, what should I see?

What I do currently see is that it looks to be about half way full of fuel.

Is that what I should be seeing? Should it be full of fuel or should it be empty?

Maybe it's something, maybe it's nothing.

Thanks!

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Re: I Can't Get No, Satisfaction - or - My 49 P-18 Won't Sta

Post by Root Beer Stand » Tue Feb 22nd, 2011 3:58

Sometimes the simple things are the hardest to find...... In most cases overthinking can is a curse!

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Re: I Can't Get No, Satisfaction - or - My 49 P-18 Won't Sta

Post by Johnny_S » Wed Feb 23rd, 2011 11:27

Sounds like way too much fuel to me.

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Re: I Can't Get No, Satisfaction - or - My 49 P-18 Won't Sta

Post by dsweidman » Thu Feb 24th, 2011 10:53

Shouldn't be seeing gas down there. If you removed the entire carb and looked into the intake manifold and see fuel, something is pluggin up the works. (A mouse-house?)

If thats the case, it's time to remove and/or clean out the intake manifold.

That's my 2 cents worth.

perrymedik
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Re: I Can't Get No, Satisfaction - or - My 49 P-18 Won't Sta

Post by perrymedik » Thu Feb 24th, 2011 7:17

dsweidman wrote:Shouldn't be seeing gas down there. If you removed the entire carb and looked into the intake manifold and see fuel, something is pluggin up the works. (A mouse-house?)

If thats the case, it's time to remove and/or clean out the intake manifold.

That's my 2 cents worth.

Yep that's exactly what I saw. Just had the Intake/Exhaust Manifold gasket set orderd from NAPA. Going to pick it up tomorrow after work and spend Saturday taking off the Manifold. With everything else working, it does seem like there would be something keeping the fuel from reaching the plugs.

If nothing else, what better way to spend a Saturday!

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Re: I Can't Get No, Satisfaction - or - My 49 P-18 Won't Sta

Post by dsweidman » Thu Feb 24th, 2011 8:20

Not sure if you've ever taken the manifolds off before, but there is a center bolt "hiding" at the bottom of the whole assembly, in the middle. You can't see it unless you are under the engine looking up.

You can use this opportunity to repair your heat riser, if it's not working. You can also clean and paint the whole thing. I did mine in one day.

I might be explaining something you already know, but during re-assembly, only hand tighten the 4 studs that connect the upper and lower manifolds. Then install the entire unit onto the block and torque all the flange studs. Then, go back and tighten the 4 studs that hold the upper and lower halves together.
If you have a service manual, it explains all this. Have a good time and let us know what you find.

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Re: I Can't Get No, Satisfaction - or - My 49 P-18 Won't Sta

Post by perrymedik » Fri Feb 25th, 2011 4:06

Nope, haven't taken them off before, but I do have the service manual. Good thing to!

I picked up the gaskets from NAPA today, so I have those as well as the gasket kit for the Carb, should I decide to tear it down as well.

Do you think any RTV would be recommended when I remount the manifolds? I got Felpro Gaskets, which I understand to be a quality product.

Tomorrow (saturday) will be my tear down day. I am really hoping to find something gunked up in there and that is the cause of my problems. Here's to hoping for strange things! LOL!

Cory

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Re: I Can't Get No, Satisfaction - or - My 49 P-18 Won't Sta

Post by dsweidman » Fri Feb 25th, 2011 8:16

I typicaly don't use any sort or sealer on the gaskets, except, a very thin layer of non-hardening Permtex, just to keep the gasket in place during assembly. I wouldn't recommend any RTV. It will just stink up the place and won't really offer any additional sealing.

You'll have to drain the radiator abuout 1/3 before removing the manifolds. A couple of the front manifold studs actualy go into the water box. When you remove those, water will run out for awhile unless you've drained out the radiator a little. This won't happen, though, if your studs stay in the block and just the nuts come off. But I've never seen that happen. Usualy one or 2 of the nuts stay with the stud and studs comes out of the block. It's not abig deal, just make they are sealed when re-installing.

Before removing anything, you may want to attempt to clean out the intake manifold. (After removing the carb, of course) It may save alot of headache. Try looking in there with a light and a small mirror and attempt to clean out, or suck out, whatever is stuck in there. But if that doesn't work, take it all apart. Be patient and be careful.

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Re: I Can't Get No, Satisfaction - or - My 49 P-18 Won't Sta

Post by perrymedik » Sat Mar 12th, 2011 1:25

What a beautiful weekend it is here!! And to think, I actually have time to tinker today!

So, here is the status so far. I took a look around in the Intake manifold and found nothing. No debris or anything obvious.

So with gasket kits in hand I have removed all of the bolts that are holding the Intake and Exhaust Manifold in place, as well as that little hidden one dead center on the bottom, as well as disconnecting the exhaust pipe.

now it could be that it is because the manifolds have never been removed since 1949 or something, but I can not seem to get them to come off the side of the engine! It's rediculous. I'm about ready to start driving screw drivers inbetween the flanges and the block to get it to seperate. Not ideal, but I can't think of anything else.

Is there something left attached that is just not obvious?

Anyone have any experience or suggestions before I ruin something?

Thanks for the help!

Cory

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Re: I Can't Get No, Satisfaction - or - My 49 P-18 Won't Sta

Post by perrymedik » Sat Mar 12th, 2011 7:44

Never mind. As I understood the manual the Intake and exhaust manifolds came off as one unit.

I found out the hard way that there are two hidden exhaust manifold screws under the intake manifold. Now I have a broken Intake and Exhaust manifold.

Any recommendations on where to purchase new ones??

And now my next item. . . .

After getting the Intake Manifold off, I took a look at it and found no obstructions. What should I be looking for when I look in the side of the block?

Thanks for the help!!

I feel like I am inches (litterally) from solving this problem.

Cory

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Re: I Can't Get No, Satisfaction - or - My 49 P-18 Won't Sta

Post by dsweidman » Sun Mar 13th, 2011 12:38

Cory-
So sorry to hear about the broken manifolds. Yes, unfortunately, those lower studs are hard to locate. Chalk this up to a lesson learned, and don't loose heart. I'm sure there is someone on this forum that has spare manifolds. You can post in the "Parts wanted" section. Keep an eye on e-bay as well. I've seen them for sale from time to time.

Back to the original issue...You've inspected the manifolds and there is no pluggage? Then I would suspect the very bottom flange assembly on the carb. There is a butterfly valve at the bottom called the carburetor throttle valve. It opens and closes with the throttle shaft. If that valve is broken or stuck closed, it could be holding the fuel from entering the intake manifold.

I've attached a file showing an exploded view of the carb. It may help you become familiar with the operation.
Keep working at it. Once done, it will all be worth it. Take care.
Attachments
carb.pdf
(48.03 KiB) Downloaded 102 times

perrymedik
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Re: I Can't Get No, Satisfaction - or - My 49 P-18 Won't Sta

Post by perrymedik » Mon Mar 14th, 2011 3:49

Dsweidman,

The reason I took the manifold off was because fuel was pooling in the intake manifold. So it was getting past the carb, just not getting to the plugs.

Frustraiting. :x

Now I need to check to see if the valves are stuck closed. I feel like I'm inches away from finding the problem. Litterally.

We'll just have to wait and see. Once I get this fixed and figure out if the the valves are moving then I just don't know what the problem could be.

It's a real head banger of a problem.

Cory

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Re: I Can't Get No, Satisfaction - or - My 49 P-18 Won't Sta

Post by Johnny_S » Mon Mar 14th, 2011 3:52

Have you checked compression?

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Re: I Can't Get No, Satisfaction - or - My 49 P-18 Won't Sta

Post by Johnny_S » Mon Mar 14th, 2011 3:54

Have you tried a small (small) shot of ether rather than raw gas?

perrymedik
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Re: I Can't Get No, Satisfaction - or - My 49 P-18 Won't Sta

Post by perrymedik » Mon Mar 14th, 2011 5:15

No, didn't check compression. As for the shot of gas, yep. but at the time I was still having problems getting spark. Got the spark problem fixed and now I'm not getting gas to the plugs it seems.

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